**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Apr 18 08:42:39 2002 --> Bagder (~daniel@as3-3-2.ras.s.bonet.se) has joined #rockbox --- Topic for #rockbox is Open Source Jukebox Firmware - http://bjorn.haxx.se/rockbox/ --- Topic for #rockbox set by Zagor at Fri Apr 12 15:45:52 --> Zagor2 (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) has joined #rockbox --- Zagor2 is now known as Zagor --> Linus (~linus@labb.contactor.se) has joined #rockbox wtf is the story with the makefile? there's a story? umm.. well.. all the >>>>> and <<<<<< and ======= stuff ah, that's a conflict you and someone else changed the makefile the >>>>>, <<<< and ===== describe the two versions which makefile btw? uisimulator nevermind.. i just did and update on my end... ok adiamas adi|atWork could someone tell me where their lcd.h is located? i don't have one and i need to grab it off a remote box... makefile is complaining ah it's in the firmware module I have uisimulator and firmware checked out in the same dir ? so in the uisim dir I can get it ../firmware/lcd.[ch] im really starting to dislike cvs rockbox, rockbox/uisimulator, rockbox/firmware yeah.. but _i_ don't wanna work on firmware you do now ;-) but your telling me that i need to pull it down and keep it up to date huh ? no but you need that source. we don't want to duplicate it because the uisim uses firmware code * adiamas giggles can't we break it out into another "library" or "common" dir or something? and have a third module you need? seems that makes more sense.. nope.. still only be two.. why should i worry about firmware if i only want to play with the uisim thing is, I want the uisim to use as much "real" code as possible nods because the uisim simulates the firmware nods okay.. now.. because im stupid.. if i just want to pull the files down and not checkout... whats the cvs command? or do i co no matter what? yes there's only checkout, yes nod im so much more used to sccs :) but since you don't modify them, you won't get problems updating them in the future sccs is good, but not for widely distributed development * adiamas nods i understand the use of cvs.. just feels icky cause im not used to it widely/wildly it takes some getting-used-to, I agree --> wavey (~wavey@dlan1431.dircon.co.uk) has joined #rockbox hey ho wavey --- Zagor is now known as Zagor|work goodly morning hmm... okay.. anyone know wtf firmware/system.h would bitch on uisim compile? complaing about the #define \'s hm lemme check what does it say? it works here gcc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -DGETTIMEOFDAY_TWO_ARGS -DSIMULATOR -DHAVE_LCD_BITMAP -I../firmware -g -c uibasic.c In file included from ../firmware/lcd.h:24, from lcd-x11.h:24, from uibasic.c:36: ../firmware/system.h:52: parse error before `volatile' ../firmware/system.h:62: stray '\' in program and then like 100 iother stray complaints.. but i figure those are ghosts what gcc version is this? * Bagder suspects the crlf newlines... gcc version 2.95.3 20010315 (release) im not switching to the 3.0 series till its aged a bit on linux, right? yup ill tell you if its crlf one sec looks like it... i load it in emacs and it comes in DOS format mode rather yes so try stripping them off and compile and see if that removes the warnings ummm.. how do i do that easily? tr -d '\015' < system.h >system2.h then use the version 2 of course yup.. that did it... ok so we need to be more careful on the newlines so when i get diffs on what i do and others do.. clashes and what not.. and we get the <<<<<<<<<< and> >>>>>>> complaints.. how do we resolve those? the makefile can include a newline checker adiamas adi|atWork adiamas adi|atWork thats a good idea adiamas: those are conflict markes that appear when you get an update that has changes on the same lines you have changed locally right.. i know.. but how do we resolve them... ie: you change int i to int duck and i want int wolf what happens? you edit out the "wrong" piece and keep the correct hehe but which is wrong? you need to figure that out it's a conflict with your changes we can't tell you what's right ;-) but it may only be a conflict with my changes because someone elses bug fix may be diff then mine.. and it clear out theres and place mine.. then theirs is in conflict and round the wheel turns... yes, but that's why you need to pick one of the alternatives. Or write a new approach ;-) * adiamas reminds you he's still new to this ;) one last question, then bed... is there a way to set my searchable include dirs in my env so that the makefile can find what it needs if things are in diff locations? it's possible to pass as arguments to make bah.. was trying to avoid that... it could be environment variables too we should figure out a way to let people do this easily * adiamas nods fixed.. settled for a symlink and said screw it way to go ;-) adiamas: -IX -IX+1 -IX+2 for your makefile include entry will search X, X+1 and X+2 .. where X, X+1 and X+2 are include dirs if i understand your q correctly so people edit their makefile to include all their includes in the $(INCLUDE) directive that's how I do it especially on cygwin, where the includes are all over the place oh, and I replace the use of -I$(INCLUDES) with simply $(INCLUDES) to ensure the first -I doesn't translate into -I-IX * wavey goes back to OO modelling of course, we could always use autoconf * wavey runs hehe wavey nah.. that i know.. the part that was issue was the libs.. yeah.. editing the makefile isn't an issue.. i just don't want to have to keep fixing it each time i pulled down a clean copy and all so i just tossed LIBDIRS in the env and do make -e * adiamas shrugs oh, libs - i thought you said includes hehe nope... im used to makefiles.. just not used to dealing with that on a new starting project :) w/ other ppls machines and all 'is there a way to set my searchable include dirs in my env' ha * wavey knew he wasn't going mad hehe sorry... i think i need bed too 1 - 0 to wavey ;-) but i've been awake only a couple hours its 0430 here.. cut me some slack ;) heh go to bed :) can't sleep :( this heatwave here is killing me.. came to quick... where are you? NY state, usa bout, 30 mins north of NYC aha how hot can it be at 0430? hit 93 today at work... ouch yeah... hope the ac is working don't have any just a ceiling fan double ouch nods i find turning lights off and working by candle makes it cooler (both definitons of cooler) * wavey blinks besides.. the gf comes up this weekend.. so sweat is a good thing then ;) heh btw.. its no ac at home.. work has it.. ah glad to hear it * Bagder counts, 33.9 celsius = 93 fahrenheit = 307 kelvin uk has been mild/warm for a few weeks now s'lovely had the first rain in ages yesterday we have like 9C today... :-/ hehe we are in a near drought situation already... no lawn watering, town just passed restrictions on pool filling wow and across america over 100 records were broken due to the high heat we use CDs in the uk now NYC had it's hotest temp on this day in history, for the 3rd day in a row. they're smaller and shinyier * adiamas quirks his head to the side and looks at wavey i don't get it. records broken cd ah.. heheh it's late you're tired im ugly too :) its understandable :) heheh but shhh.. thats a secret * Bagder looks at wavey, oooooh that was a pretty bad one ;-) everyone's beautiful in ascii lol... i like that... congrats.. you just joined my sig file :) eheh heh in ebcdic however, everyone's a pig is that why we've switched to ascii these days then? B-] yup :) and frosted mirrors too wavey.. whats your real name so i can credit you all proper like :) stuart martin, if you need the credit. take it for yourself with my pleasure btw.. its 70 F here, 21 c UV Index: 0 Minimal heheh i wonder why... could it be the suns not up? :) when is dawn these days? any of you read scifi? dawn as in sun rise or dawn as in the book? sunrise in NY 05:12 almost finished two olaf stapledon books. 1930s author - one of his books describes the history of humanity (over 200 000 000 years) and the other describes the history of the universes both fantastic, btw nods (according to my psion) absolutely recommend them wavey, feel like mailing me the book names? either that.. or msg me them... 'last and first men' and 'starmaker' nods the channel is quiet, i'm sure no one cares :) got it. okay.. bed time night all night adiamas see ya --- adiamas is now known as adi|sleep * Bagder is curious on Linus I2C and MAS work... i2c? whassat ooh, only 15*6 songs left on my random playlist of 3500 songs :) that's how to speak to the MAS circuit one quick note.. did you guys realize there is a key lock on the jbr? yus on nods hehe i din't :) back to bed :) heh night * Bagder has hardly used his recorder yet :-) we need a tiny math lib for our code we do which projects can we steal it from? I dunno actually we could probably "steal" function by function from BSD or Linux code sure be nice if sourceforge allowed a search through open source project's codebases for things be very useful true make it easier for industry to rip it off as well i guess not that it doesn't happen already anyway The I2C is going slow at the moment. But the MAS is responding. *cool* ...occasionally. :-) hah occasionally cool :-) heh what about data structures? we cutting our own linked lists, etc? we could probably use a sensible single implementation for many to use must be a nice and small and tested-to-hell one in apache or somewhere yus --- Zagor|work is now known as Zagor btw, we're having a litte "rockbox" gathering tomorrow the stockholm/sweden parts of the rockboxers how close do you guys live together? 20km 'variable pitch control' is that achieveable by the MAS? (from the mail list) nope can't be done rockbox lunch time hey you know if the DAC can have 2 channels on at once? I don't think so. Lemme check. It seems like we can mix all channels, AUX1 AUX2 and DAC Cool. Then we can hear the RS232 data when we are debugging. :-) --- Zagor is now known as Zagor|lunch yeah? nice --- Zagor|lunch is now known as Zagor --- wavey is now known as wav_lunch * wav_lunch smiles timezones. who'd have 'em? they're useless * Zagor wants to do away with timezones and daylight savings time yus one hour, globally who cares if 0515 is in your afternoon? exactly. it's just a bloody number * PsycoXul agrees swatch tried it with Internet Time only met one person with such a watch though if the world's consumers had embraced the concept, the governments may have agreed to it anyhow lunch the problem was that they wanted to alter everyone's sense of time. the changed too much people still want 12+12 hour days, 60 hours minutes etc --> alkorr (jbcoax@srs04m-2-107.n.club-internet.fr) has joined #rockbox Welcome Alan! hi linus hi there i have a question Ask! quite now we cannot use other formats than MP3 not even a WAV file the recorder is able to get a linear PCM on digital line True if i'm not wrong, wav format is a PCM-like stream yes wav is usualy just pcm with a header afaik my idea is the following if we strip unused infos and feed internally the digital pin of MAS with a PCM stream (using sci0 ?) and set MAS for recording would you hear this wav playing ? I don't follow you. Do you want to play WAV files on the recorder? a trick which could allow recorder to play wav files (not forgetting possibility of mixing) i read on the company's website about the player's MAS and they claimed to have pcm playback firmware for that chip anyways, likely the recorder's chip too... of course getting any such things i dunno, never found any downloads etc The MAS is capable of playing WAV files. You just have to download firmware to it. i think it is not free can archos firmware do whats necessary to download firmware to the MAS? i tried to get this addition but without success yes it could if it have additions to upload has but i'm doubtful that Archos will buy this addition for its player/recorder. i think we need a dsp hacker to the project :) of course if we could know what kind of DSP it is and have compilers, it would be great yes but Micronas are unlikely to reveal anything about this DSP why? Do you know a lot of company which reveal all the works ? their what DSP they use is hardly "all the works" anyway, companies are not bound for revealing something :) perhaps they don't want to let a non Micronas employee to be able to reverse-engineer their works they are commercial, not open free :) well they DO have a devkit that they supply to their customers they mention it and some of the things in it example firmware and such yes but if they don't let people write dsp code, who will buy their dsp? customers => archos, not final users customers must pay for it ! true including some voice compression codec decoder and encoder, and pcm player yeah but there are a few customers of the MAS perhaps we could ask around so somebody find a friend of a friend of a friend who works for a customer ... heh okay if you can a smart guy to help for retrieving missing infos and even get tools, that would be great find getting the tools is probably not legal and if he/she is not concerned with a NDA too I doubt all customers sign NDAs to buy the MAS devkit ya, if we could have opcodes, we can create an assembler but what i know it should be 24-bit opcodes (code addresses are 24-bit) btw, if you look at MAS commands, to upload a firmware you must issue a command and a block of 32-bit words but only the first 24 bits in those words are valid (or it should be 12-bit ?) hum found a 1 MB pdf... the data sheets speaks of 20-bit words ok so it is 20-bit i found a page where someone said what DSP was in fact wow i try to get it back MASC 3500 ? not 35000 ? anyway not a target we can find for gcc or as :( uh no http://winwww.rutgers.edu/~samar/platforms/masc3500.html ya found nice digging! the guy who wrote that web page could have some info yes i tried but i wonder if his email address is still valid he has two, try both ;-) hum i prefer let you to try both ;) "MASC 3500 is NOT supported by C compiler. Only assembler programming is available" actually, I think I'll hand over that work to Bj�rn okay *thump* got it :) he's the man ;-) :) so..um... what do we want to know, exactly? whether he has an archos for a start :) --- wav_lunch is now known as wavey have all the information he can feed us about this DSP : especially all the opcodes haha haha "I was especially interested in digital modulation techniques and speech processing. So, embedded systems and numerous real-time DSP implementations (telephone line modems, low bit-rate speech coding...)" he's our man! There was only one commercially available MPEG layer 3 chip, the MASC3500 from ITT Intermetall Semiconductor. We attempted to obtain information and availability of the chip, but the company is situated in Germany and gave very little feedback not a good sign yes it is the main culpritt of thy company this humm i mean the main discredit for this company :) your point is usually clear, al :) A. Domazetovic, D. Samardzija, "Implementation of 4880 bps CELP on MASC 3500 DSP", Conference on Telecommunications ETRAN, Vrnjacka Banja, Yugoslavia, Jun 1998. anyone near a library? in yugoslavia? * wavey chuckles lol D. Samardzija, Z. Lukac, "A Solution of CELP Encoder at 5.3kbit/s and 6.3kbit/s on ITT MASC 3500 Processor", Conference on Telecommunications ETRAN, Vrnjacka Banja, Yugoslavia, Jun 1998. well in a very good english : "this lack of feedback is the rock(box) on which the undertaking comes to grief" ;) yay, we've got a poet! ;) al: and now in italian, please :) italian you are ? (without using babelfish) italian I am not english I am arf ;) arf is a lovely word :) "questa mancanza di risposte � la roccia(boccia) su cui l'impresa viene al dolore " ;) roccia boccia * Bagder giggles arf => lol fantastic! :)